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Next: The Rose Award For 8-18-2008.
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External
Since: Jan 16, 2006
Posts: 27
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 12:53 pm
Post subject: E mail from Bob and Walt?
Archived from groups: alt>sports>baseball>cinci-reds (more info?)
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Dear Fans,
Thank you for your loyalty and support of the Cincinnati Reds. You are
extremely vital to the success of the Reds, and it is important we
share with you the thinking behind our recent personnel decisions.
Since taking ownership of this franchise, we have aggressively tried
to improve our Major League roster for the purpose of restoring
championship baseball to Cincinnati. We have sought and signed proven
players. We have extended the contracts of select current players. We
added Dusty Baker, a proven winning manager. And, we have capitalized
on our burgeoning younger players like Joey Votto, Jay Bruce and
Johnny Cueto.
We had high expectations for the 2008 season. Unfortunately the team
has not played up to our expectations and we have sustained injuries
to key players within our starting lineup and rotation.
We opted to trade Ken Griffey Jr. and Adam Dunn at this time because
we believe it provided the best outcome for the long-term success of
the organization. By executing these inevitable changes now, we
secured more players as part of our focus towards building a deeper,
stronger inventory of young talent.
We are pleased that the trades allow Griffey and Dunn the opportunity
to play for teams in tight division races. Both Ken and Adam made
significant contributions to the Reds and we are extremely proud and
grateful they wore the Reds uniform.
While the run production generated by these two veterans will not be
quickly replaced, we chose to endure the short-term ramifications for
the sake of building a strong, competitive team for 2009 and many
seasons to come.
The vast majority of our 50 draft picks were signed, culminating last
week with first-rounder Yonder Alonso and a pair of talented pitchers.
Our expanded scouting operations also signed Juan Duran from the
Dominican Republic and Yorman Rodriguez from Venezuela, who are
arguably the best amateur free agent position players from their
respective countries.
As we near September, we will continue to provide valuable playing
time to our young players and new acquisitions who we feel can become
significant contributors at the Major League level. We ask your
continued trust and patience as we build the roster that will get us
back on top. We appreciate your support and look forward to seeing you
at the ballpark.
Did anyone else find this strange? They need to do something maybe
this is a start.
Odd |
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External
Since: Dec 07, 2006
Posts: 410
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 5:59 pm
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 12:53:45 -0700 (PDT), "shark265@bright.net"
<shark265 RemoveThis @bright.net> wrote:
>Dear Fans,
>
>Thank you for your loyalty and support of the Cincinnati Reds. You are
>extremely vital to the success of the Reds, and it is important we
>share with you the thinking behind our recent personnel decisions.
>
>Since taking ownership of this franchise, we have aggressively tried
>to improve our Major League roster for the purpose of restoring
>championship baseball to Cincinnati. We have sought and signed proven
>players. We have extended the contracts of select current players. We
>added Dusty Baker, a proven winning manager. And, we have capitalized
>on our burgeoning younger players like Joey Votto, Jay Bruce and
>Johnny Cueto.
>
>We had high expectations for the 2008 season. Unfortunately the team
>has not played up to our expectations and we have sustained injuries
>to key players within our starting lineup and rotation.
>
>We opted to trade Ken Griffey Jr. and Adam Dunn at this time because
>we believe it provided the best outcome for the long-term success of
>the organization. By executing these inevitable changes now, we
>secured more players as part of our focus towards building a deeper,
>stronger inventory of young talent.
>
>We are pleased that the trades allow Griffey and Dunn the opportunity
>to play for teams in tight division races. Both Ken and Adam made
>significant contributions to the Reds and we are extremely proud and
>grateful they wore the Reds uniform.
>
>While the run production generated by these two veterans will not be
>quickly replaced, we chose to endure the short-term ramifications for
>the sake of building a strong, competitive team for 2009 and many
>seasons to come.
>
>The vast majority of our 50 draft picks were signed, culminating last
>week with first-rounder Yonder Alonso and a pair of talented pitchers.
>Our expanded scouting operations also signed Juan Duran from the
>Dominican Republic and Yorman Rodriguez from Venezuela, who are
>arguably the best amateur free agent position players from their
>respective countries.
>
>As we near September, we will continue to provide valuable playing
>time to our young players and new acquisitions who we feel can become
>significant contributors at the Major League level. We ask your
>continued trust and patience as we build the roster that will get us
>back on top. We appreciate your support and look forward to seeing you
>at the ballpark.
>
>
>Did anyone else find this strange? They need to do something maybe
>this is a start.
Why did you think it was strange? I don't see anything I'd wonder about
in it. Seems just an attempt to put some positive PR spin on recent
events. No harm, no foul.
It does bother me that Griffey and Dunn, in this e-mail and in plenty of
other places, keep getting lumped together, as if their careers are at
the same point and their current value is equal (or more to the point,
that Griffey is still seen as a star who is better than Dunn).
Getting rid of Griffey was a good move. They got what was a reasonable
return for him.
Dunn presumably has a number of very productive years ahead of him. He
is not a faded superstar on his last career legs, who has been brittle
for years. In his case it isn't a matter of getting rid of him or not,
if that's what they decided to do, they should have done it right and
gotten equal value in return. I may have brought up that point somewhere
before, though.
Those were two almost entirely different types of trades, and that they
are not being considered as such is troublesome...particularly when it
is the ownership and front office who is doing it!
******************************************************************
Kevin McClave
"To justify himself, each relies on
the other's crime." ~Albert Camus
****************************************************************** |
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External
Since: Dec 23, 2003
Posts: 154
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 11:15 pm
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Tue, 19 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 12:53:45 -0700 (PDT), "shark265@bright.net"
> <shark265.TakeThisOut@bright.net> wrote:
>
>> Dear Fans,
>>
>> Thank you for your loyalty and support of the Cincinnati Reds. You are
>> extremely vital to the success of the Reds, and it is important we
>> share with you the thinking behind our recent personnel decisions.
>>
> Dunn presumably has a number of very productive years ahead of him. He
> is not a faded superstar on his last career legs, who has been brittle
> for years. In his case it isn't a matter of getting rid of him or not,
> if that's what they decided to do, they should have done it right and
> gotten equal value in return. I may have brought up that point somewhere
> before, though.
>
> Those were two almost entirely different types of trades, and that they
> are not being considered as such is troublesome...particularly when it
> is the ownership and front office who is doing it!
>
Do you want them to take the time to explain the distinction
in this letter? I don't know what more they could have gotten
for Dunn, one of the smartest GM's in baseball was willing to
let him go for a song and another one, obviously not too bright,
didn't want anything to do with him. The low return probably
had more to do with his career situation rather than his talent.
I wish Dunn well. He played every day and he wasn't lazy as many
have accused him. I think he is a better fit for a team which
is already competitive though as his shortcomings really stand
out on a team which cannot overcome them. And then when he
contributes more than his share to victories, the fact that total
victories don't add up to greater than .500 somehow open
him up to blame which he no way deserves. I used to bitch about
his meaningless home runs and rbi's but this year I thought
that evened out a bit so maybe it was just an illusion or
luck of the draw.
I've been watching the Arizona box scores and he is doing well
over there.
> ******************************************************************
> Kevin McClave
>
> "To justify himself, each relies on
> the other's crime." ~Albert Camus
> ******************************************************************
> >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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External
Since: Dec 07, 2006
Posts: 410
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:32 am
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:15:26 -0400, Zuke <me.DeleteThis@privacy.net> wrote:
>On Tue, 19 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 12:53:45 -0700 (PDT), "shark265@bright.net"
>> <shark265.DeleteThis@bright.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Dear Fans,
>>>
>>> Thank you for your loyalty and support of the Cincinnati Reds. You are
>>> extremely vital to the success of the Reds, and it is important we
>>> share with you the thinking behind our recent personnel decisions.
>>>
>> Dunn presumably has a number of very productive years ahead of him. He
>> is not a faded superstar on his last career legs, who has been brittle
>> for years. In his case it isn't a matter of getting rid of him or not,
>> if that's what they decided to do, they should have done it right and
>> gotten equal value in return. I may have brought up that point somewhere
>> before, though.
>>
>> Those were two almost entirely different types of trades, and that they
>> are not being considered as such is troublesome...particularly when it
>> is the ownership and front office who is doing it!
>
>Do you want them to take the time to explain the distinction
>in this letter?
Of course not. That wasn't my point. My point is that there should be a
distinction in the first place, and I also clearly stated that this is
not a lumping together that only occurred in this letter. That's why I
raised it, because it seems to be a common thing.
> I don't know what more they could have gotten
>for Dunn, one of the smartest GM's in baseball was willing to
>let him go for a song and another one, obviously not too bright,
>didn't want anything to do with him. The low return probably
>had more to do with his career situation rather than his talent.
As David has pointed out a few times, they screwed up in one prime way
with their poor timing/planning. David has suggested that is a seperate
issue to their getting equal value in return, but it's not a separate
issue. Nothing happens in a vacuum. You can't screw things up the way
they did and then say "well, we got what we could because it was after
the non-waiver deadline and so we got a couple of sore armed pitchers
and a catcher who has no position."
Honestly, I am really amazed, given the history with the acquisition of
Gary Majewski for one thing (and the general negativity of fans for
another), that I seem to be the only person unhappy with this deal.
Again, not *that* they traded Dunn, but that they screwed it up so
badly. I'll go back to a comment I made at the beginning of these
discussions and say that I am disgusted that the organization has
"trained" us to find this sort of garbage acceptable...and even to some,
apparently, a good idea.
>I wish Dunn well. He played every day and he wasn't lazy as many
>have accused him. I think he is a better fit for a team which
>is already competitive though as his shortcomings really stand
>out on a team which cannot overcome them. And then when he
>contributes more than his share to victories, the fact that total
>victories don't add up to greater than .500 somehow open
>him up to blame which he no way deserves. I used to bitch about
>his meaningless home runs and rbi's but this year I thought
>that evened out a bit so maybe it was just an illusion or
>luck of the draw.
No, you were wrong. Nearly half of his HRs during his Reds career were
hit to give the Reds the lead or to tie games. I have posted those stats
here several times in the past six months or so.
******************************************************************
Kevin McClave
"To justify himself, each relies on
the other's crime." ~Albert Camus
****************************************************************** >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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External
Since: May 21, 2007
Posts: 288
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:49 pm
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Kevin McClave wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:15:26 -0400, Zuke <me.TakeThisOut@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 12:53:45 -0700 (PDT), "shark265@bright.net"
>>> <shark265.TakeThisOut@bright.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dear Fans,
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for your loyalty and support of the Cincinnati Reds. You are
>>>> extremely vital to the success of the Reds, and it is important we
>>>> share with you the thinking behind our recent personnel decisions.
>>>>
>>> Dunn presumably has a number of very productive years ahead of him. He
>>> is not a faded superstar on his last career legs, who has been brittle
>>> for years. In his case it isn't a matter of getting rid of him or not,
>>> if that's what they decided to do, they should have done it right and
>>> gotten equal value in return. I may have brought up that point somewhere
>>> before, though.
>>>
>>> Those were two almost entirely different types of trades, and that they
>>> are not being considered as such is troublesome...particularly when it
>>> is the ownership and front office who is doing it!
>> Do you want them to take the time to explain the distinction
>> in this letter?
>
> Of course not. That wasn't my point. My point is that there should be a
> distinction in the first place, and I also clearly stated that this is
> not a lumping together that only occurred in this letter. That's why I
> raised it, because it seems to be a common thing.
>
>> I don't know what more they could have gotten
>> for Dunn, one of the smartest GM's in baseball was willing to
>> let him go for a song and another one, obviously not too bright,
>> didn't want anything to do with him. The low return probably
>> had more to do with his career situation rather than his talent.
>
> As David has pointed out a few times, they screwed up in one prime way
> with their poor timing/planning. David has suggested that is a seperate
> issue to their getting equal value in return, but it's not a separate
> issue. Nothing happens in a vacuum. You can't screw things up the way
> they did and then say "well, we got what we could because it was after
> the non-waiver deadline and so we got a couple of sore armed pitchers
> and a catcher who has no position."
After Jim Bowden's frantic pace. Dan O'Brien seemed to be moving at a
glacial pace. When he was moved out and Krivsky took over, you would
have thought all communication between the reds front office and the
rest of the world was going on over a telegraph or something. I do
understand that part of that was just Wayne's style of playing
everything very close to the chest.
I'm not sure that Walt Jockety has lifted up a telephone as the GM of
this club. He didn't deal Junior till the deal came to him. I think he
put Dunn on the waiver line and said..."oh, it looks like the
Diamonbacks got him." David Ross.....I don't know what to say. I've
never been a huge David Ross fan, but you mean to tell me you can't
trade him FOR ANYTHING!...I just don't know what to say. It's like there
is NO communication between this front office and anybody else.
Why did ownership wait so long to hang up the white flag? Were they
really playing for 500 as announced or were they just lazy?
Is there a difference?
dfs >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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Since: May 09, 2007
Posts: 302
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 2:21 pm
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Aug 22, 3:55 pm, Zuke <m....RemoveThis@privacy.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
> > On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:15:26 -0400, Zuke <m....RemoveThis@privacy.net> wrote:
>
> >> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
>
> >>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 12:53:45 -0700 (PDT), "shark...@bright.net"
> >>> <shark....RemoveThis@bright.net> wrote:
>
> >>>> Dear Fans,
>
> >>>> Thank you for your loyalty and support of the Cincinnati Reds. You are
> >>>> extremely vital to the success of the Reds, and it is important we
> >>>> share with you the thinking behind our recent personnel decisions.
>
> >>> Dunn presumably has a number of very productive years ahead of him. He
> >>> is not a faded superstar on his last career legs, who has been brittle
> >>> for years. In his case it isn't a matter of getting rid of him or not,
> >>> if that's what they decided to do, they should have done it right and
> >>> gotten equal value in return. I may have brought up that point somewhere
> >>> before, though.
>
> >>> Those were two almost entirely different types of trades, and that they
> >>> are not being considered as such is troublesome...particularly when it
> >>> is the ownership and front office who is doing it!
>
> >> Do you want them to take the time to explain the distinction
> >> in this letter?
>
> > Of course not. That wasn't my point. My point is that there should be a
> > distinction in the first place, and I also clearly stated that this is
> > not a lumping together that only occurred in this letter. That's why I
> > raised it, because it seems to be a common thing.
>
> >> I don't know what more they could have gotten
> >> for Dunn, one of the smartest GM's in baseball was willing to
> >> let him go for a song and another one, obviously not too bright,
> >> didn't want anything to do with him. The low return probably
> >> had more to do with his career situation rather than his talent.
>
> > As David has pointed out a few times, they screwed up in one prime way
> > with their poor timing/planning. David has suggested that is a seperate
> > issue to their getting equal value in return, but it's not a separate
> > issue. Nothing happens in a vacuum. You can't screw things up the way
> > they did and then say "well, we got what we could because it was after
> > the non-waiver deadline and so we got a couple of sore armed pitchers
> > and a catcher who has no position."
>
> > Honestly, I am really amazed, given the history with the acquisition of
> > Gary Majewski for one thing (and the general negativity of fans for
> > another), that I seem to be the only person unhappy with this deal.
> > Again, not *that* they traded Dunn, but that they screwed it up so
> > badly. I'll go back to a comment I made at the beginning of these
> > discussions and say that I am disgusted that the organization has
> > "trained" us to find this sort of garbage acceptable...and even to some,
> > apparently, a good idea.
>
> >> I wish Dunn well. He played every day and he wasn't lazy as many
> >> have accused him. I think he is a better fit for a team which
> >> is already competitive though as his shortcomings really stand
> >> out on a team which cannot overcome them. And then when he
> >> contributes more than his share to victories, the fact that total
> >> victories don't add up to greater than .500 somehow open
> >> him up to blame which he no way deserves. I used to bitch about
> >> his meaningless home runs and rbi's but this year I thought
> >> that evened out a bit so maybe it was just an illusion or
> >> luck of the draw.
>
> > No, you were wrong. Nearly half of his HRs during his Reds career were
> > hit to give the Reds the lead or to tie games. I have posted those stats
> > here several times in the past six months or so.
>
> > ******************************************************************
> > Kevin McClave
>
> Maybe this stat I saw in the comment section of the Enquirer
> Red's blog might have let to my wrongness:
>
> "ESPN the Magazine wrote this issue that Adam Dunn from 2003-07 came
> up with a runner on third and less than 2 outs 66 times and drove the
> runner in 0 times.."
Even if that stat were true, how many times do you think Dunn walked
in that situation? If you have a runner on third and less than two
out, do you really want to pitch to that team's best flyball power
guy, or do you wanna walk him and pitch to someone like Edwin
Encarnacion? There's a reason Dunn gets on base so much despite that
lousy batting average. >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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External
Since: Dec 23, 2003
Posts: 154
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 3:55 pm
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Thu, 21 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:15:26 -0400, Zuke <me.TakeThisOut@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 19 Aug 2008 12:53:45 -0700 (PDT), "shark265@bright.net"
>>> <shark265.TakeThisOut@bright.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dear Fans,
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for your loyalty and support of the Cincinnati Reds. You are
>>>> extremely vital to the success of the Reds, and it is important we
>>>> share with you the thinking behind our recent personnel decisions.
>>>>
>>> Dunn presumably has a number of very productive years ahead of him. He
>>> is not a faded superstar on his last career legs, who has been brittle
>>> for years. In his case it isn't a matter of getting rid of him or not,
>>> if that's what they decided to do, they should have done it right and
>>> gotten equal value in return. I may have brought up that point somewhere
>>> before, though.
>>>
>>> Those were two almost entirely different types of trades, and that they
>>> are not being considered as such is troublesome...particularly when it
>>> is the ownership and front office who is doing it!
>>
>> Do you want them to take the time to explain the distinction
>> in this letter?
>
> Of course not. That wasn't my point. My point is that there should be a
> distinction in the first place, and I also clearly stated that this is
> not a lumping together that only occurred in this letter. That's why I
> raised it, because it seems to be a common thing.
>
>> I don't know what more they could have gotten
>> for Dunn, one of the smartest GM's in baseball was willing to
>> let him go for a song and another one, obviously not too bright,
>> didn't want anything to do with him. The low return probably
>> had more to do with his career situation rather than his talent.
>
> As David has pointed out a few times, they screwed up in one prime way
> with their poor timing/planning. David has suggested that is a seperate
> issue to their getting equal value in return, but it's not a separate
> issue. Nothing happens in a vacuum. You can't screw things up the way
> they did and then say "well, we got what we could because it was after
> the non-waiver deadline and so we got a couple of sore armed pitchers
> and a catcher who has no position."
>
> Honestly, I am really amazed, given the history with the acquisition of
> Gary Majewski for one thing (and the general negativity of fans for
> another), that I seem to be the only person unhappy with this deal.
> Again, not *that* they traded Dunn, but that they screwed it up so
> badly. I'll go back to a comment I made at the beginning of these
> discussions and say that I am disgusted that the organization has
> "trained" us to find this sort of garbage acceptable...and even to some,
> apparently, a good idea.
>
>> I wish Dunn well. He played every day and he wasn't lazy as many
>> have accused him. I think he is a better fit for a team which
>> is already competitive though as his shortcomings really stand
>> out on a team which cannot overcome them. And then when he
>> contributes more than his share to victories, the fact that total
>> victories don't add up to greater than .500 somehow open
>> him up to blame which he no way deserves. I used to bitch about
>> his meaningless home runs and rbi's but this year I thought
>> that evened out a bit so maybe it was just an illusion or
>> luck of the draw.
>
> No, you were wrong. Nearly half of his HRs during his Reds career were
> hit to give the Reds the lead or to tie games. I have posted those stats
> here several times in the past six months or so.
>
> ******************************************************************
> Kevin McClave
Maybe this stat I saw in the comment section of the Enquirer
Red's blog might have let to my wrongness:
"ESPN the Magazine wrote this issue that Adam Dunn from 2003-07 came
up with a runner on third and less than 2 outs 66 times and drove the
runner in 0 times.." >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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Since: Apr 20, 2005
Posts: 236
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 5:13 pm
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Zuke" <me DeleteThis @privacy.net> wrote in message
> On Thu, 21 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
>> No, you were wrong. Nearly half of his HRs during his Reds career were
>> hit to give the Reds the lead or to tie games. I have posted those stats
>> here several times in the past six months or so.
>
> Maybe this stat I saw in the comment section of the Enquirer
> Red's blog might have let to my wrongness:
>
> "ESPN the Magazine wrote this issue that Adam Dunn from 2003-07 came up
> with a runner on third and less than 2 outs 66 times and drove the runner
> in 0 times.."
uuummm. according to the splits page at Baseballreference over his career
Dunn has 256 plate appearances where a runner was on third and there were
less than two out.
He had a 960 ops in those situations and drove in 135 runs.
15 RBI in that situation during 03 and I'm too tired to check the other
years.
dfs >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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Since: Aug 22, 2008
Posts: 10
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Fri Aug 22, 2008 8:08 pm
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 15:55:11 -0400, Zuke <me RemoveThis @privacy.net> wrote:
>On Thu, 21 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 23:15:26 -0400, Zuke <me RemoveThis @privacy.net> wrote:
>>
>>> I used to bitch about
>>> his meaningless home runs and rbi's but this year I thought
>>> that evened out a bit so maybe it was just an illusion or
>>> luck of the draw.
>>
>> No, you were wrong. Nearly half of his HRs during his Reds career were
>> hit to give the Reds the lead or to tie games. I have posted those stats
>> here several times in the past six months or so.
>
>Maybe this stat I saw in the comment section of the Enquirer
>Red's blog might have let to my wrongness:
>
>"ESPN the Magazine wrote this issue that Adam Dunn from 2003-07 came
>up with a runner on third and less than 2 outs 66 times and drove the
>runner in 0 times.."
Well, in the first year within that range I just went and checked,
2006, he had 11 RBI with a man on third and less than 2 outs, so...
http://www.baseball-reference.com/pi/bsplit.cgi?n1=dunnad01&year=2006
************************************************************************
Kevin P. McClave
"Fear not the path of truth for the lack of people walking on it."
~Robert F. Kennedy
************************************************************************ >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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Since: Dec 23, 2003
Posts: 154
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 1:18 am
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Fri, 22 Aug 2008, David Short wrote:
> "Zuke" <me DeleteThis @privacy.net> wrote in message
>> On Thu, 21 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
>>> No, you were wrong. Nearly half of his HRs during his Reds career were
>>> hit to give the Reds the lead or to tie games. I have posted those stats
>>> here several times in the past six months or so.
>>
>> Maybe this stat I saw in the comment section of the Enquirer
>> Red's blog might have let to my wrongness:
>>
>> "ESPN the Magazine wrote this issue that Adam Dunn from 2003-07 came up
>> with a runner on third and less than 2 outs 66 times and drove the runner
>> in 0 times.."
>
> uuummm. according to the splits page at Baseballreference over his career
> Dunn has 256 plate appearances where a runner was on third and there were
> less than two out.
> He had a 960 ops in those situations and drove in 135 runs.
>
> 15 RBI in that situation during 03 and I'm too tired to check the other
> years.
>
> dfs
>
I was just ruffling Kevin's feathers a bit. He's quite militant
on Dunn. I seriously doubt that stat is anywhere near the truth.
I mean even Corey Patterson would have knocked in a couple of
runs. >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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Since: Aug 22, 2008
Posts: 10
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 11:43 am
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 01:18:36 -0400, Zuke <me RemoveThis @privacy.net> wrote:
>On Fri, 22 Aug 2008, David Short wrote:
>
>> "Zuke" <me RemoveThis @privacy.net> wrote in message
>>> On Thu, 21 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
>>>> No, you were wrong. Nearly half of his HRs during his Reds career were
>>>> hit to give the Reds the lead or to tie games. I have posted those stats
>>>> here several times in the past six months or so.
>>>
>>> Maybe this stat I saw in the comment section of the Enquirer
>>> Red's blog might have let to my wrongness:
>>>
>>> "ESPN the Magazine wrote this issue that Adam Dunn from 2003-07 came up
>>> with a runner on third and less than 2 outs 66 times and drove the runner
>>> in 0 times.."
>>
>> uuummm. according to the splits page at Baseballreference over his career
>> Dunn has 256 plate appearances where a runner was on third and there were
>> less than two out.
>> He had a 960 ops in those situations and drove in 135 runs.
>>
>> 15 RBI in that situation during 03 and I'm too tired to check the other
>> years.
>>
>> dfs
>>
>
>I was just ruffling Kevin's feathers a bit. He's quite militant
>on Dunn. I seriously doubt that stat is anywhere near the truth.
>I mean even Corey Patterson would have knocked in a couple of
>runs.
So, you intentionally posted a stat you *knew* was incorrect just to
"ruffle my feathers?" That's more than a little lame.
I suspect that was actually the old "OMG! Adam Dunn doesn't hit any
sac flies!!!" stat you posted.
***************************************************************************
Kevin McClave
"I believe a place and a people are judged not just by their
accomplishments, but also by their compassion and sense of justice."
~Bruce Springsteen
*************************************************************************** >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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Since: Dec 23, 2003
Posts: 154
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 2:17 pm
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Sun, 24 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
> On Sun, 24 Aug 2008 01:18:36 -0400, Zuke <me.DeleteThis@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 22 Aug 2008, David Short wrote:
>>
>>> "Zuke" <me.DeleteThis@privacy.net> wrote in message
>>>> On Thu, 21 Aug 2008, Kevin McClave wrote:
>>>>> No, you were wrong. Nearly half of his HRs during his Reds career were
>>>>> hit to give the Reds the lead or to tie games. I have posted those stats
>>>>> here several times in the past six months or so.
>>>>
>>>> Maybe this stat I saw in the comment section of the Enquirer
>>>> Red's blog might have let to my wrongness:
>>>>
>>>> "ESPN the Magazine wrote this issue that Adam Dunn from 2003-07 came up
>>>> with a runner on third and less than 2 outs 66 times and drove the runner
>>>> in 0 times.."
>>>
>>> uuummm. according to the splits page at Baseballreference over his career
>>> Dunn has 256 plate appearances where a runner was on third and there were
>>> less than two out.
>>> He had a 960 ops in those situations and drove in 135 runs.
>>>
>>> 15 RBI in that situation during 03 and I'm too tired to check the other
>>> years.
>>>
>>> dfs
>>>
>>
>> I was just ruffling Kevin's feathers a bit. He's quite militant
>> on Dunn. I seriously doubt that stat is anywhere near the truth.
>> I mean even Corey Patterson would have knocked in a couple of
>> runs.
>
> So, you intentionally posted a stat you *knew* was incorrect just to
> "ruffle my feathers?" That's more than a little lame.
I didn't know it was incorrect but trusting stats you pick off the
comments section on the internet is not exactly foolproof!
Somebody else called the guy on that stat and he said he'd show
him the ESPN article.
Hey you have to have some fun with 19 losing seasons and MIke Brown
running the Bengals. Or else we will all wind up in the rubber
room. >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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Since: Apr 09, 2008
Posts: 32
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 6:23 pm
Post subject: Re: E mail from Bob and Walt? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Who lives in a pineapple under the sea, Kevin McClave
<kmcclave.RemoveThis@SPAMBUNKERtwcny.rr.com>?
> I suspect that was actually the old "OMG! Adam Dunn doesn't hit any
> sac flies!!!" stat you posted.
John Erardi wrote a pretty enlightening article in today's Enquirer.
http://news.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?
AID=/20080824/SPT04/808240439
He's been writing that series every Sunday for a while now. Pretty
good stuff IMHO.
--
Cheers,
--Jeff
Let's Go Orange! >> Stay informed about: E mail from Bob and Walt? |
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