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Sam Hutcheson wrote:
> On 27 May, 16:59, Tarkus <karnev....RemoveThis@atlantabraves.net> wrote:
>> Marty Winn wrote:
>>> Couldn't have said it better myself. Why are people so afraid that
>>> millionaires are getting rich at the expense of billionaires?
>> Jealousy. The fact that early on he brought up his own pay suggests
>> that he's jealous of what these guys make. What does anyone's pay have
>> to do with billionaires negotiating contracts with millionaires?
>
> For clarity, I think it was Ray who brought up his salary (+/- 60K
> per), not Tomasz.

Could be. But I still think there's jealousy rooted in the ridiculous
argument that Tomasz keeps putting forward. There is in most cases
where fans bitch about player salaries.

> Since then Ray has smartly dropped out of this debate and left Tomasz
> to twist in the loony tick winds.

Proving that he's the way smarter of the two.

--
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Marty Winn pisze:

> do in Colorado. Let the owners and players freely negotiate the
> contracts that both sides are willing to agree to.

Exactly. And now they can't do this.

pzdr

TRad
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On 27 May, 18:48, Tomasz Radko <t... RemoveThis @interia.pl> wrote:

> > Could be.  But I still think there's jealousy rooted in the ridiculous
> > argument that Tomasz keeps putting forward.  There is in most cases
> > where fans bitch about player salaries.
>
> Could you remind who used to cry about bad BAD owners trying to get
> profits from their investment? No, Tarkus, in this group I'm the last
> person jealous of anybody's salary.

No one amoung the regulars, actually.

s/
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Sam Hutcheson pisze:
> On 27 May, 09:58, Tomasz Radko <t....DeleteThis@interia.pl> wrote:
>> Marty Winn pisze:
>>
>>> do in Colorado. Let the owners and players freely negotiate the
>>> contracts that both sides are willing to agree to.
>> Exactly. And now they can't do this.
>
> Please give us an example of a contract that some combination of owner
> and player did not freely negotiate, Tomasz.

As you well know they are forbidden to sign some types contracts even if
both sides would agree to them. So don't tell fairy tales about freedom.

pzdr

TRad
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Tomasz Radko wrote:
>> Please give us an example of a contract that some combination of owner
>> and player did not freely negotiate, Tomasz.
>
> As you well know they are forbidden to sign some types contracts even if
> both sides would agree to them. So don't tell fairy tales about freedom.

But players freely choose to enter the employ of major league baseball,
knowing that there will be restrictions on the types of contracts they
will be able to sign.

One might make an argument re: the monopoly power of MLB, but players
choose to be governed by these rules.

Colin
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Colin William pisze:
> Tomasz Radko wrote:
>>> Please give us an example of a contract that some combination of owner
>>> and player did not freely negotiate, Tomasz.
>>
>> As you well know they are forbidden to sign some types contracts even
>> if both sides would agree to them. So don't tell fairy tales about
>> freedom.
>
> But players freely choose to enter the employ of major league baseball,
> knowing that there will be restrictions on the types of contracts they
> will be able to sign.

So what? I'm free to emigrate to North Korea and work there (not that
I'd like to). Does it makes North Korea less socialistic?

> One might make an argument re: the monopoly power of MLB, but players
> choose to be governed by these rules.

Colin, I'm not trying to tell that players are oppressed. Socialism
doesn't necessary means poverty and misery. It means: lack of freedom.
And a large part of MLB universum is socialistic. It's a gold cage, but
it's a cage.

pzdr

TRad
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Tomasz Radko wrote:
>>>> Please give us an example of a contract that some combination of owner
>>>> and player did not freely negotiate, Tomasz.
>>>
>>> As you well know they are forbidden to sign some types contracts even
>>> if both sides would agree to them. So don't tell fairy tales about
>>> freedom
>>
>> But players freely choose to enter the employ of major league
>> baseball, knowing that there will be restrictions on the types of
>> contracts they will be able to sign.
>
> So what? I'm free to emigrate to North Korea and work there (not that
> I'd like to). Does it makes North Korea less socialistic?

That wasn't the issue in the above question, which I have left in to jog
your memory; the question was whether MLB contracts are freely entered
into and negotiated. Some players hold out in order to negotiate more
favorable terms of entry, and some do not. But to the extent that
players choose to enter the MLB negotiation structure to begin with,
they do so freely.

I do agree that there could be more free latitude here, but MLB owners
don't want that. They want to trade training for some period of time
where they extract value back for that training.

Colin
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In article <WaadnYEVaoUd66HVnZ2dnUVZ_rXinZ2d.DeleteThis@earthlink.com>,
karnevil9.DeleteThis@atlantabraves.net says...
> Colin William wrote:
> > Marty Winn wrote:
> >> Couldn't have said it better myself. Why are people so afraid that
> >> millionaires are getting rich at the expense of billionaires?
> >
> > I wouldn't even say "at the expense of". The millionaires are getting
> > rich and helping the billionaires get even richer. Everybody wins. MLB
> > is doing so well right now that even Selig can't complain about the
> > economics.
>
> Yeah, isn't it just sick, that everyone's getting so rich?

When that "everyone" isn't me, damn straight!

--
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Colin William pisze:

> I do agree that there could be more free latitude here, but MLB owners
> don't want that. They want to trade training for some period of time
> where they extract value back for that training.

I don't think owners are the only to blame for.

pzdr

TRad
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"Tomasz Radko" <trad.TakeThisOut@interia.pl> wrote
>> I do agree that there could be more free latitude here, but MLB owners
>> don't want that. They want to trade training for some period of time
>> where they extract value back for that training.
>
> I don't think owners are the only to blame for.

Well, of course you wouldn't. You like to blame labor for everything.

Colin
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Colin William pisze:
> "Tomasz Radko" <trad.TakeThisOut@interia.pl> wrote
>>> I do agree that there could be more free latitude here, but MLB owners
>>> don't want that. They want to trade training for some period of time
>>> where they extract value back for that training.
>> I don't think owners are the only to blame for.
>
> Well, of course you wouldn't. You like to blame labor for everything.

Nope. For the bad weather I'm blaiming freemasonry.

pzdr

TRad
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Tarkus pisze:
> Sam Hutcheson wrote:
>> On 27 May, 16:59, Tarkus <karnev....TakeThisOut@atlantabraves.net> wrote:
>>> Marty Winn wrote:
>>>> Couldn't have said it better myself. Why are people so afraid that
>>>> millionaires are getting rich at the expense of billionaires?
>>> Jealousy. The fact that early on he brought up his own pay suggests
>>> that he's jealous of what these guys make. What does anyone's pay have
>>> to do with billionaires negotiating contracts with millionaires?
>>
>> For clarity, I think it was Ray who brought up his salary (+/- 60K
>> per), not Tomasz.
>
> Could be. But I still think there's jealousy rooted in the ridiculous
> argument that Tomasz keeps putting forward. There is in most cases
> where fans bitch about player salaries.

Could you remind who used to cry about bad BAD owners trying to get
profits from their investment? No, Tarkus, in this group I'm the last
person jealous of anybody's salary.

pzdr

TRad
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