Jack Wilson

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 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

"Brian Matthews" <noonecares.DeleteThis@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:77btg3hpbnsum1egh2gk202a2an1som56r@4ax.com...
>>you can judge range just by looking at the put outs and assists. Wilson is
>>clearly superior to Renteria defensivley.
>
> But not on offense. I heard Wilson was a very good fielder but I never
> saw him play for an extended period. So what to do, go after a good
> glove or an average glove with a little better hitting? They already
> have a very good glove, light hitting shortstop in Santiago. Could
> Wilson be a much better hitter than Santiago? If not, it's a wasted
> move. It wouldn't surprise me if the Tigers go for a trade for
> Renteria.
>
> Brian



I'd rather see them trade for a slugging outfielder. Or first baseman.





>
 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

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"Brian Matthews" <noonecares.DeleteThis@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:d7vug393rvm53tai6blca2vfheguhl0fbo@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 02:09:18 -0400, "Bill Kawalec"
> <billkawalec.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Brian Matthews" <noonecares.DeleteThis@ddd.com> wrote in message
>>news:77btg3hpbnsum1egh2gk202a2an1som56r@4ax.com...
>>>>you can judge range just by looking at the put outs and assists. Wilson
>>>>is
>>>>clearly superior to Renteria defensivley.
>>>
>>> But not on offense. I heard Wilson was a very good fielder but I never
>>> saw him play for an extended period. So what to do, go after a good
>>> glove or an average glove with a little better hitting? They already
>>> have a very good glove, light hitting shortstop in Santiago. Could
>>> Wilson be a much better hitter than Santiago? If not, it's a wasted
>>> move. It wouldn't surprise me if the Tigers go for a trade for
>>> Renteria.
>>>
>>> Brian
>>
>>
>>
>>I'd rather see them trade for a slugging outfielder. Or first baseman.
>
> Guillen's playing first base next year. At least, that's the plan they
> announced. I guess we'll see what happens.......


I'd still rather see them trade for a slugging outfielder. Or first baseman.





>
> Brian
 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

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 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

"Brian Matthews" <noonecares.RemoveThis@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:cuivg3pekcttg2soed46tqra64g6kauao7@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 14:20:45 -0400, "Bill Kawalec"
> <billkawalec.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Brian Matthews" <noonecares.RemoveThis@ddd.com> wrote in message
>>news:d7vug393rvm53tai6blca2vfheguhl0fbo@4ax.com...
>>> On Fri, 12 Oct 2007 02:09:18 -0400, "Bill Kawalec"
>>> <billkawalec.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"Brian Matthews" <noonecares.RemoveThis@ddd.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:77btg3hpbnsum1egh2gk202a2an1som56r@4ax.com...
>>>>>>you can judge range just by looking at the put outs and assists.
>>>>>>Wilson
>>>>>>is
>>>>>>clearly superior to Renteria defensivley.
>>>>>
>>>>> But not on offense. I heard Wilson was a very good fielder but I never
>>>>> saw him play for an extended period. So what to do, go after a good
>>>>> glove or an average glove with a little better hitting? They already
>>>>> have a very good glove, light hitting shortstop in Santiago. Could
>>>>> Wilson be a much better hitter than Santiago? If not, it's a wasted
>>>>> move. It wouldn't surprise me if the Tigers go for a trade for
>>>>> Renteria.
>>>>>
>>>>> Brian
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I'd rather see them trade for a slugging outfielder. Or first baseman.
>>>
>>> Guillen's playing first base next year. At least, that's the plan they
>>> announced. I guess we'll see what happens.......
>>
>>
>>I'd still rather see them trade for a slugging outfielder. Or first
>>baseman.
>
>
> Guillen's playing first base next year.
>


only if they acquire a shortstop. I'd still rather see them trade for a
slugging outfielder. Or first baseman.







> Brian
 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

The Tigers should wait until the A-Rod situation resloves itself. If A-rod
leaves NY and goes to another team, that teams SS becomes available for a
cheap price. Specifically if A-Rod ends up with the Cubs and uncle Lou that
would make available Ryan Theriot or Ronny Cedeno , both highly regarded
middle infielders. Either one of these players are better than Santiago and
Wilson or Rentieria and have a high upside.
"Brian Matthews" <noonecares DeleteThis @ddd.com> wrote in message
news:rlusg3tbfgjq59bj0ohsfn35u18ss3def2@4ax.com...
> Think the Tigers are going to go after Jack Wilson as a FA? His
> numbers aren't too impressive. Nothing really ugly, it just looks like
> he's a below average hitter. His error numbers aren't great, but
> they're not horrible, either. Has anyone had a chance to see him play
> on a regular basis? Does he have good range at SS? I'm just wondering
> if he would be better than Edgar Renteria, who I read the Tigers may
> go after in a trade. I read Renteria's range isn't very good. I think
> we can all agree that ARod isn't an option? Too costly and it would be
> a risk putting him back at SS. His bat would be nice but I really
> think the money isn't there for him to come to the Tigers. Who does
> everyone think would be the best bet to be wearing a Tigers uniform at
> shortstop next year?
>
> Wilson's numbers;
> http://www.baseball-reference.com/w/wilsoja02.shtml
>
>
> Renteria's numbers;
> http://www.baseball-reference.com/r/renteed01.shtml
>
>
> Brian
 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

On 2007-10-13, serveyerself <serveyerself.RemoveThis@comcast.net> wrote:
> The Tigers should wait until the A-Rod situation resloves itself. If A-rod
> leaves NY and goes to another team, that teams SS becomes available for a
> cheap price. Specifically if A-Rod ends up with the Cubs and uncle Lou that
> would make available Ryan Theriot or Ronny Cedeno , both highly regarded
> middle infielders. Either one of these players are better than Santiago and
> Wilson or Rentieria and have a high upside.
> "Brian Matthews" <noonecares.RemoveThis@ddd.com> wrote in message

Why not move Inge to 3rd, and sign a 3rd baseman? I'd bet he could play
it, and it should be easier to sign a powerhitting 3rd baseman.

> news:rlusg3tbfgjq59bj0ohsfn35u18ss3def2@4ax.com...
>> Think the Tigers are going to go after Jack Wilson as a FA? His
>> numbers aren't too impressive. Nothing really ugly, it just looks like
>> he's a below average hitter. His error numbers aren't great, but
>> they're not horrible, either. Has anyone had a chance to see him play
>> on a regular basis? Does he have good range at SS? I'm just wondering
>> if he would be better than Edgar Renteria, who I read the Tigers may
>> go after in a trade. I read Renteria's range isn't very good. I think
>> we can all agree that ARod isn't an option? Too costly and it would be
>> a risk putting him back at SS. His bat would be nice but I really
>> think the money isn't there for him to come to the Tigers. Who does
>> everyone think would be the best bet to be wearing a Tigers uniform at
>> shortstop next year?
>>
>> Wilson's numbers;
>> http://www.baseball-reference.com/w/wilsoja02.shtml
>>
>>
>> Renteria's numbers;
>> http://www.baseball-reference.com/r/renteed01.shtml
>>
>>
>> Brian
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

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 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

"Brian Matthews" <noonecares.RemoveThis@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:pcv9h3pecgul5f6vjsd9unpjdh2pv1qtuj@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 15 Oct 2007 20:26:12 GMT, chuck <chuck.RemoveThis@invalid.net> wrote:
>
>>> The Tigers should wait until the A-Rod situation resloves itself. If
>>> A-rod
>>> leaves NY and goes to another team, that teams SS becomes available for
>>> a
>>> cheap price. Specifically if A-Rod ends up with the Cubs and uncle Lou
>>> that
>>> would make available Ryan Theriot or Ronny Cedeno , both highly regarded
>>> middle infielders. Either one of these players are better than Santiago
>>> and
>>> Wilson or Rentieria and have a high upside.
>
> The problem with that is we would have to trade quality. The Cubs
> wouldn't give away a quality middle infielder. And the Tigers have too
> many other needs. Sign as many FA players as possible and make trades
> only when we have to.


I agree, to a point.



>
> The Tigers need, 2 starting pitchers (at least), a closer, a shortstop
> and a left fielder.
>



I don't agree at all. What they need is for the starters they have to pitch
up to their abilities, as in '06.


> We don't even need major sluggers at the SS and LF position.


There are no "major slugging" shortstops, but I could not agree with you
less re left field. If they go into '08 without more power in the lineup,
I'm convinced they're content to be in the permanent rebuilding mode.




Just very
> high on base percentage players. We already have slugging power. What
> cost us making the playoffs this year is lack of pitching. It's
> impossible to win by trying to outslug other teams when your pitching
> gives up more runs than your sluggers can produce.



well, yeah, but, there were many games they could have won by scoring more.
it's a balance. I'm not assuming that the pitchers won't perform better in
'08.




>
> Brian
 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

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"Brian Matthews" <noonecares.DeleteThis@ddd.com> wrote in message
news:fg6ah318elrlt0tdpi5o67hktkb9ec067h@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 16 Oct 2007 15:02:13 -0400, "Bill Kawalec"
> <billkawalec.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>> We don't even need major sluggers at the SS and LF position.
>>
>>
>>There are no "major slugging" shortstops, but I could not agree with you
>>less re left field. If they go into '08 without more power in the lineup,
>>I'm convinced they're content to be in the permanent rebuilding mode.
>
>
> Well, Thames hits home runs about once every 15 at bats.


as a platoon player. I want a REAL full time outfielder.



That's pretty
> impressive. Put him in LF for an entire year and he should produce. As
> for SS? I wouldn't mind a high percentage on base hitter who can lead
> off. Put Granderson 3rd in the line up.


second. ONLY if the do acquire a true leadoff hitter though. Batting #2
could make Granderson more of a contact hitter, thus cutting down the
strikeouts, BUT, I don't want to see tampering without good reason.



Shef will have to swallow his
> pride and realize at his age he's a # 6 hitter.



You underestimate the effect of his presence on the pitches Ordonez sees.
Again, do not tinker without a good reason.





We could score even
> more runs that way.


assumption.



But pitching is still the problem. In 2006 the
> Tigers had the best ERA in baseball, last year it was the reason we
> didn't make the playoffs.


ok, Rogers needs to be replaces. Zumaya and Rodney need to be healthy.



We scored more runs in 2007 but won less
> games. There's no telling if 2006 was the norm with this pitching
> staff, maybe 2007 was.



seems, however, that you have concluded that it's 07, and gone into a panic
mode. I am not panicked. I have more faith (FAR more) in Miller's future
than Maybin's. He needs work on endurance, and that only comes with
experience.





What we need are a couple of shut down
> starters.



WILL NOT happen. Do you have ANY clue what that would cost, in $$$ if the
FAs are out there, or in personnel, if you look to trade for them?





The best Tigers starter is Verlander, after that it's all up
> in the air with major question marks.



just can't agree on the "major question marks."




Is Bonderman ever going to learn
> a 3rd pitch and live up to his potential? Is Robertson anything more
> than a 5th starter?



....and? Every team needs one.



And who are the Tigers going to use as the other 2
> starters? Miller, Jurrjens, Miner or Durbin? I'm not sure the Tigers
> would be big winners with that pitching staff.


one can never be "sure" of anything. MFYs thought A Rod was a winner.




I would rather see them
> go after a top starter than a major slugger for LF. Pitching and
> defense wins championships.


winning ballgames wins championships. It has been done with mediocre
pitching, and< i assure you, will be again.



That's why DD has placed such a big
> importance on pitching in the draft.


I will not presume to interpret his intentions, but, the (highly successful)
Earl Weaver theory was that you **always** draft pitching, then you can
trade for your other needs.






The Tigers have plenty of hitters
> to knock in and score runs, we just need to find some pitching to stop
> the other teams from scoring more than we can produce.



....or produce more.
You do realize that both KC and Minnesota had better team ERAs than the
Tigers? Point is, there is no absolute formula. It's the BALANCE.











>
> Brian
 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson 

"Bill Kawalec" <billkawalec DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:Vq6dnZurLKAuvojanZ2dnUVZ_tGonZ2d@comcast.com...
> You do realize that both KC and Minnesota had better team ERAs than the
> Tigers? Point is, there is no absolute formula. It's the BALANCE.
>



AND Toronto. Second best ERA in the league there, yet five games worse than
the Tigers. Yank's team ERA was a mere .08 better than the Tigers. BUT, they
scored 968 runs.
 >> Stay informed about: Jack Wilson