Barry Bonds Hall of Fame Voting

*This is
why wink-wink nudge-nudge dopesters like Lance Armstrong, Barry Bonds,
and the entire NFL pass their drug tests. *

Come on now, we all know Lance won the last few TDF because he was one
testicle lighter than the rest of the competition...except for the
Frenchmen, who we all know have *no* testicles.
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CodeThis wrote:
> Why all the anti-Bud Selug questions and steroids?
> Sure, Bud Selug knew about the steroid abuse ... but why blame him?
>
> Blame the Players Union!
> The owners tried to get a steroid ban / penalty in MLB, but the Union would
> never allow it.

Not really. MLB tried (on several occasions) to impose a drug policy
but had zero interest in *negotiating* one.

If you're making reference to the Vincent memo, Vincent's made it clear
in recent interviews that it was kind of a throw away thing -- that
MLB's primary focus was on recreational drugs.

It was of so little importance to him that he can't even recall
what motivated him to write the memo.

> Amazing how the media always screws up the facts.
> So much easier to single out one person.
>
> The Players Union should be hung out to dry on this issue.
> This steroid debacle is entirely the Union's fault.

Only if you accept that the PA should have accepted whatever
MLB wanted to do on the issue

If MLB wanted a policy on performance enhancing drugs they
were free to bargain for it. Wasn't important enough to MLB.
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mishajmo.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com wrote:
> Canny wrote:
> > extreme thinker, which I am not though I believe Bonds'
> > acceptance into the Hall of Fame wouldn't be the first time a cheater
> > has been let in, would say that a guy like Gary Sheffield, who has had
> > shoulder problems and has a well-documented past of using cortisone is
> > MORE guilty of performance enhancement through chemicals.
>
> Sheffield also has admitted to using 'roids

When? If you're referring to his grand jury testimony, no he
didn't.

> AND to deliberately tanking
> plays to get out of Milwaukee

Actually he said it was in a dispute with the scorer.

Quoting:

If the official scorer gave me an error that I didn't think was an
error I'd
sy 'OK, here's a real error,' and I'd throw the next ball into the
stands on purpose.''

Problem being that if you do a tracer on this, it's simply not
true. He may have felt that way. May have been tempted,
but he had only one two error game all year in 1991 and
made successful plays between his error in the third
and ninth.

Don't get me wrong. Sheffield was doing everything in his
power to force a trade. He called the Brewers a racist
organization, behaved like a jerk to (among others) Bill
Spiers. Hell, he says explicitly in a SI interview that he
used the media to force a trade.

"It's the truth," he says. "That's what I did. I had to get out
of Milwaukee."

>[God knows what he has done and *not*
> admitted] Doesn't deliberately tanking plays AFFECT THE SCORE and
> therefore THROW THE GAME. Dude should have a lifetime ban like Pete
> Rose.

RIght. If it actually happened. Best I can tell it didn't.

Yes he made a lot of errors in 1991. He always made a lot of
errors at third. Had a career fielding percentage of .933. Made one
more error in 1992 than you'd have expected from his career
fielding numbers. (And his DA numbers -- while terrible -- are
also perfectly in line with his career numbers)

Hell look at his fielding numbers in 1993.

What interesting is that if he'd said he was tanking at the plate in
1991 I simply couldn't refute the claim
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Am 17.5.2006, CodeThis schrieb:

> Why all the anti-Bud Selug questions and steroids? Sure, Bud Selug
> knew about the steroid abuse ... but why blame him?
>
> Blame the Players Union! The owners tried to get a steroid ban /
> penalty in MLB, but the Union would never allow it. Amazing how the
> media always screws up the facts. So much easier to single out one
> person.
>
> The Players Union should be hung out to dry on this issue. This
> steroid debacle is entirely the Union's fault.

entirely?

Come on.

For one, I don't think the player's union all of a sudden sent out a
flyer saying that members should juice up. I don't know for sure, but
I'd guess that it started with individual players (or perhaps
trainers) trying to get ahead of the game. From bland, corporate
entities like TribCo to win-at-all-costs guys like Steinbrenner, the
owners rewarded (and thus encouraged) the dopesters with fat
contracts. TribCo, the Cardinals' owners, and Selig were only too
happy to have those late ninties 'roid romps. I don't recall anyone
asking Marky Mark or Sammy to stop juicing.

In fact, the owners were especially happy to have juicing the player's
responsibility. All they had to do was sit back and reap the
benefits. If and when someone got busted, the owners could simply say
"we didn't ask them to do that". Well, maybe not, but since athletes
have to compete for their jobs, once performing enhancing drugs get
into a sport, almost everyone has to use them.

The union's position is to protect its members on-the-job interests.
If its members are dopesters, well, then it's going to protect
dopesters. However, drugs are also a worker safety issue, and the
union should therefore have an interest in ridding the sport of
steroids.

Everyone comes off bad in this story: owners, players, union, writers,
TV -- even the fans.


--
Barutan Seijin -- barutanseijin.RemoveThis@gmail.com
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Why all the anti-Bud Selug questions and steroids?
Sure, Bud Selug knew about the steroid abuse ... but why blame him?

Blame the Players Union!
The owners tried to get a steroid ban / penalty in MLB, but the Union would
never allow it.
Amazing how the media always screws up the facts.
So much easier to single out one person.

The Players Union should be hung out to dry on this issue.
This steroid debacle is entirely the Union's fault.

--
"Spreading a little of my special sunshine, throughout usenet hell."
-CodeThis
 >> Stay informed about: Barry Bonds Hall of Fame Voting 

In article <69Gag.13649$Nw6.11214@trnddc03>,
blowme.RemoveThis@haveaniceday.com says...
>
> Why all the anti-Bud Selug questions and steroids?
> Sure, Bud Selug knew about the steroid abuse ... but why blame him?
>
> Blame the Players Union!
> The owners tried to get a steroid ban / penalty in MLB, but the Union would
> never allow it.
> Amazing how the media always screws up the facts.
> So much easier to single out one person.

Actually, we probably would've had drug testing in place for 20
years if it hadn't been for Bowie Kuhn. They *had* an agreement
in place for a year, but Kuhn announced that anything not
specifically covered the agreement would be up to his sole
discretion and the MLBPA took the out after the year.

After MLB repeatedly tried to ban Steve Howe in violation of the
decisions in binding arbitration, the MLBPA would've had to have
been completely nuts in trusting the owners in a drug agreement.

--
Dan Szymborski
dan.RemoveThis@baseballprimerREMOVE.com

"A critic who refuses to attack what is bad is not
a whole-hearted supporter of what is good."

-Robert Schumann
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In article <69Gag.13649$Nw6.11214@trnddc03>,
"CodeThis" <blowme RemoveThis @haveaniceday.com> wrote:

> Why all the anti-Bud Selug questions and steroids?
> Sure, Bud Selug knew about the steroid abuse ... but why blame him?
>
> Blame the Players Union!
> The owners tried to get a steroid ban / penalty in MLB, but the Union would
> never allow it.
> Amazing how the media always screws up the facts.
> So much easier to single out one person.
>
> The Players Union should be hung out to dry on this issue.
> This steroid debacle is entirely the Union's fault.

Bzzzt! Incorrect.

The owners had absolutely no interest in rocking the boat. They knew
damn well what was going on, but what did they care--all the HRs were
bringing the fans back.

And let's not forget the fans. We all knew what was going on, and yet we
flock to the games in record numbers. Rather disingenuous to have
enjoyed all those golden steroid years and now act all outraged and
shocked and indignant.

EVERYBODY had a role in the problem, and it really pisses me off that
everyone would rather create a scapegoat than confront their own
responsibility.

--
JD

"...if you think the 'Star Wars' prequels are a disease, then
'Serenity' is the cure."
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"Jeanne Douglas" <> The Players Union should be hung out to dry on this
issue.
> > This steroid debacle is entirely the Union's fault.
>
http://www.misterpoll.com/3422742869.html A new question about the Players
Union was added for everyone that felt that all the blame was being put on
Bud Selig.
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